Sofvi Bootlegging Scumbags

Discussion in 'Other Asian Toys' started by badteethcomics, Oct 31, 2017.

  1. boon velvet

    boon velvet Post Pimp

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    No worries, Ha, yeeaah, it was a lot, but I am glad that you replied with your views about what I said so I can clarify some things further if others feel that way too.

    I tried to be very clear that I understand from what Joe said and I believe him and feeling I have a pretty good grasp of his character I feel his motivations were innocent and whoever is shit talking his person based on his decision to sell a bootleg, should chill, as we all make decisions that can result in things we may not realize at the time. That was really one of the only personal views I expressed, besides everything else, I wanted it to be heard that I also understand where Joe was coming from initially and the hate is nonsense …

    No it shouldnt matter who it is (I was not purposely singling out Joe other than him being a part of the actual situation I was responding to), but by selling something that you put your personal touch on you gotta agree that you are saying it’s okay, that’s just how it is. I understand there are gray unknowns, but people only know what they are presented with and when your opinions have weight, regardless of the media or field, when you have a large fan base, there’s a greater chance for others to follow suit however they interpret it, thus there an influence of opinion, regardless of Joe’s motivations, and where those same people may scoff at the idea with a passionate stance if their Grandma was to express something along similar lines. That’s just how it always goes and why the same people who may bash an artist doing it that they’re not a fan of will come to the defense of the same exact actions from their favorite artists, and they won’t even realize they’re doing it necessarily and justify it differently.

    It’s not about “come down on Joe” and I actually have zero hard feelings of any nature here (and that’s why speaking on it really sucks , especially involving Joe in a thread with the word scumbags in it, cause he’s so not a scumbag). I think those that are belittling his character are going too far, BUT I hear why they’re upset , because he was the 1 who made that decision around something where much passion exists. And where so much emphasis seemed to be being put elsewhere and even blaming those for feeling some kind of way when that’s how it’s always been in these parts and a focus many believe most sofubi artists share, so people are going to be upset, it doesn’t matter what we even think is realistic or not, my main focus in what I struggled to find the words for was trying to relay what didn’t seem like was being heard about why the reasons for their feelings are justifiable. It is something people feel very strongly about in this community, and for many valid reasons that have been important to collectors and artists for a long time, so I get it. If it was any of those other artists you mentioned, or anyone I’m very close with, I would have written the same, as I did not mean to come across like I was bashing anyone and only meant to offer some clarification from what I was seeing and just wasn’t witnessing.

    And of course, you’re right 100% Robert, the same should apply to everyone, but unfortunately just like with this and any passionate situation where there’s a large fan base, a fence will be constructed and there will be pitchforks and there will be praise and equal standards will go out the window for many. There will always be bias and all we can do is try to uphold our own. If someone in my family does something I feel some kind of way about, I try to be the same as I would if someone I have no relationship did the same something.

    Yeah, it’s long again. I’ll leave it there. I spoke on this way more than I intended but considering what I wrote must have come across differently than that intention, which I never want, I hope I explained now a little better on what I was trying to say the first time. Yeah, comprehension, big struggle here too. Anyway, hope you had a nice new year out your way, brodiddly, and here’s hoping this next year kicks the last one’s ass. Too much heartache last year. There’s definitely so many things more important than this topic, but I still feel there’s validity in the need for people to talk about it and it’s been damn interesting to hear so many viewpoints.
     
  2. xSuicide Squadx

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    @eckotyper My views have changed significantly from when the thread started, indeed. And despite the fact that you keep hammering that it’s only changed by one circumstance, it’s just simply changed period. I think your example of Headlock bein’ booted and my response made that pretty clear.

    I was pissed as shit for everyone when it first started, with the exception of Nags. I admittedly couldn’t care less about Nags. However, as time went on and I gained my personal perspective of it being hopeless to stop and pointless to be pissed, so I just stopped caring about wasting the energy to be upset. It’s really that simple.

    As per my example of painted versions being stripped, repainted and sold, it was more about the disrespect to the artists being stripped and the profiting off it, and not in direct relation between that and straight bootlegging. I could’ve reiterated. I don’t even see a problem with that either anymore, but I did at the time because the shit was still rare. And other artists were shit on for doin’ the same thing, ironically, stripping Paul, Joe and Rich’s toys and painting customs to sell.

    No, Paul and Jon hadn’t had their full sculpts booted as far as I know, just heads. Not sure why that matters.

    Does Joe get some golden ticket from me ‘cause I’m a fan? No. He gets the same ‘pass’ as literally anyone else would from me, ‘cause of my grown apathy towards it, and inability to actively do anything about it. Am I encouraging people to buy the shit and do what Joe did? Passively by not going out of my way to condemn it, perhaps. But not directly by saying “Yeah, it’s cool, go do it.” I think JP’s probably encapsulated both arguments where he’s reiterating my points, but also making great ones for the other side. At the end of the day, I’m not buyin’ ‘em, have no interest, don’t back it, but get why people do and why people don’t. Apathy for not caring/‘giving the pass’. Passion for defense of a single artist, to the point of makin’ personal attacks thought to be in private towards another. Two side of the fence indeed, like I said.
     
  3. eckotyper

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    Fair enough. I totally get one’s views can change especially years in between. Growth, reflection are just two words i can associate with it. i brought up if full sculpts had been counterfeit because that’s what i thought you meant. I don’t care that it’s just Rich’ work. I care that all of it is and has been happening. It sucks that not only authentic collabs got on the list , even if it happened just once is included, and even worse… all the head mashups he does just because the joints fit… forcing the art one way or another. Now that i understand you on what you meant by that i hope you know I’m just as annoyed about all things he has counterfeited from rich to hxs to nag. Like i said before he has shown he has went down the wormhole to actually try new things… the bronze stuff is cool on a new medium/skill level we aren’t as used to see on our level of niche community collecting… i think he just has went about this all wrong as he might of actually got artists collabs with that bronze and such of he wasn’t bottlefeeding off of their( any and all artists getting counterfeit) IP. I feel those who really wanted to chime in on this have had plenty of time to do so. Those who chose to say their peace have. Now we can prepare to start week 2 of 2022 maybe on a reset without being as wound up
     
  4. The Moog

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    What name is his account under nowadays? I wanna see what that rapscallion is up to. Last thing I remember was the vacuum chrome stuff ...
     
  5. doomboy

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    he is now called ' sofubi_sales_fuck_your_mother ',obviously a lovely bloke....
     
  6. gatiio

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    Lol. Terrible name. Thanks for that, I’m going to follow now.
     
  7. gatiio

    gatiio Side Dealer

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    Hey SB, here's some fun story time to kickstart your monday!

    I found out that HxS blocked me on insta, so much for his ukraine peace robot post. lol. which means I cant follow and drool over his derivative robos anymore (sadface).

    What I would love to find out is if he blocked me bc I am always going on and on about his methods here OR bc I am following sofubi_sales_fym and actively liking the posts there OR because Im always pissing on the sale2meBro club he's got, which has been the most put off thing about this maker, Or all of the above. Which is also why I didn't bother to post in his thread since this isn't entirely about those original toys :razz:

    Either way, I probably deserve it.

    Dunno, It made me chuckle and then I got a bit bummed that the fan/audience/follower (ie. me) is getting the short end of the stick. it's not like I ever was a member of the secret (a'la pus) club or had the money to fly to his mediocre openings and kiss ass. This just leads me to believe that as long as I am not flexing on spending literal thousands of dollars I do not have, I wont be seen as a 'trve' collector. ROFL

    In any case, since Ive prolly been blacklisted across his enterprise I went ahead and ordered a few replicas from Sofubi_sales just to check the quality, since at this point what do I have to lose? no more HxS for moi? LOL Thats already decided since the last lotto I won of his which is from the pre-sofubi-boom times. (teeshirt and minis for anyone trying to guess a date) ;___;

    So! to add to everyone's points, you can tell from A MILE away that these aren't the droids... ahem, robots we are looking for.

    The sculp is way softer and there are imperfections from the molding process that are glaring evidence of hasty craftsmanship (finger prints on the mold, bubbles, fuzzy details, odd joints, etc) Basically all the bootleg features we have come to love as charming and inherent to the process.This is something I enjoy a lot and treasure in this type of work. Its like the flash on Mexican boots and gaudy colors.
    Size seems about the same, I don't have the others in hand. The vinyl does feel a pinch more brittle on the denser parts, but overall they are decent copies that show their origin and compete with the originals not on the merits of the work, but on the conceptual ground they participate in (collecting and the aura of the precious object) things that have always been a drawn for me as an adult collector of (adult) toys.

    They are really fun to play with so I've given them to the lil kid and he's having a blast with them, much more fun than the actual original HxS sitting in a garage melting away in Texas/Mexico without anyone ever playing with them.

    The vinly is obviously Chinese, less shiny, a bit more squishy in that early unbox industries way. If someone falls for this as an original, then they deserve to lose that chunk of change.
    Its like comparing Mexican bootleg He-Man toys to the super7 line up. As a collector and for items of this caliber, due diligence should be made by all parties, so if someone gets scammed by this, they were probably a mark for anything else already.

    But yeah, to all getting upset the makers are getting shafted and the artistry is being desecrated for pure capital gain, its not and they aren't. These are very clearly a copy and a few photos from anyone that knows a bit and what to ask for would prove that without needing to have one in hand or paying to play.

    Just wanted to share my two cents, as I am very interested in all of these pachi-bootleg environments and get a real excitement out of seeing folk create with these other conceptual tools. Unlike Nag which seems to be created kwas size garbage these days as well. hehehe.

    Anyhow, here's a pic of the smaller gatiio playing with their new toys and showing me how to really enjoy these overpriced dollies.

    [​IMG]


    Also, the guy from Sofubi_sales, pretty smooth to communicate with, fast & easy transaction with no hassle or shadiness. WeChat FTW! Just another Chinese manufacturer finding his niche which is what all of these new wave makers are doing half the time.

    PS pls don't ask me to sale 2 you Bro my original HxS, this post isnt an invitation to that and all of the ones I own have already been promised to folk here (which is also not an invitation for you to ask to get in some 'line' in case there's a flake).
     
  8. The Moog

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    Very interesting, thanks for the report.
     
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  9. ultrakaiju

    ultrakaiju Die-Cast Staff Member

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    Thanks @gatiio, useful to hear these sorts of things and contextualise all the aspects of it, too. I can't speak to any of the apparent shenanigans, either on the side of exclusive sales or bootlegging hyped toys, as I seem to be wholly on the outside looking in, and definitely not a true collector evidently, but it is essentially a chicken and the egg situation at this stage, and really moot whichever came first. But both seems to be an unfortunate mark on the hobby which should just be focused on the appreciation of plastic toys. You have to seem to live with one, or the other (or, in some cases, both).
     
  10. rattanicus

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    So glad I don’t give a shit about HxS, but I do love the drama! :lol:
    And now I’m interested in the bootlegs..
     
  11. gatiio

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    I recommend it. Like scary Andy said, it really helps pass time

    It’s the best drama

    It’s like a k-drama but instead of model-like actors we have a bunch of Middle Aged toy nerds that dress like shit.
     
  12. Ali from Baghdad

    Ali from Baghdad Fresh Meat

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    @gatiio Thanks for sharing, I found it very funny that Hxs could be so petty. I fully agreed on what Steve said, obviously Hxs and all other hype culture helped the bootleg. I do love his early toys and may consider buying a Gorilla-ju someday, just maybe, but apparently I have and will have nothing to do with this man. But on the other side, I also found this boot manufacturer very unpleasant for I once have his Wechat out of curiosity. His Chinese is so poor that I sometimes have difficulties in understanding what he is talking about, and he seems to be a pretty arrogant guy (maybe he talks to "foreigners”in another tone). So I could say I stand on neither of these two sides now and completely on the outside too.
     
  13. Urk

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    Any guesses on where these are being made if his Chinese is poor? That's an interesting detail to me and it has made me rather curious about the bootlegger
     
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  14. Ali from Baghdad

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    As far as I know, this guy are living in the suburb of Beijing, the same city I live but I don't know where he produces those boots, maybe in the same place, maybe somewhere in Guangdong province. And he speaks a poor Chinese because he is obviously uneducated, but I am also curious how he could even communicate in English, maybe via a translation tool?
     
  15. Mr Fox

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    Based on morbid curiosity I took at look at the offending account and, interestingly, he also seems to be selling actual bronze versions of certain figures. Would a standard mould also allow someone to poor metal into it as well as vinyl? I assumed metal casting would follow a different process / grade of mould.
     
  16. Roger

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    They probably have a hard copy in resin (likely a casting of a genuine vinyl toy), and from that they can make wax copies. Those wax copies can be used to make electroplated molds for sofubi or do what they call lost-wax casting for bronze sculptures.
     
  17. Anti Social Andy

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    Hirota was a great guy until he had his head turned by success, fell victim to his own hype and started believing everything he saw and heard via social media!
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2022
  18. xSuicide Squadx

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    I just always assumed they got legitimate vinyl versions of whatever they’re bootlegging and go off of that. It’s been said to me that Bandai and B - Club reproductions do this, and that’s why some sculpts are a little smaller than the originals ‘cause the sculpts shrink a bit in the wax to metal molding process. I’ve held some bootleg Hirota and Nags, and those in particular were actually really solid and had some heft. Thick vinyl.
     
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  19. Ali from Baghdad

    Ali from Baghdad Fresh Meat

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    Yeah, I can feel that, before I go on ebay (you know haha), I read the Hxs thread from the start to the last page. It is sad seeing things turned bad during the years. Edit: but I also love to see the way people here speak "frankly" towards Hxs nowadays, haha.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2022
  20. Ali from Baghdad

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    Yeah, you are all right, we Chinese even have a special term for this procedure, cause it is pretty common in the whole area of toys collecting. They even do this on some rare Bandai Gashapons or Gundam models. Also, Marusan did this back in 1966 cause the original mold was broken, so the 2nd issued Garamon and Gomess are smaller than the 1st issued ones.
     
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  21. JoeMan

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    Some dope just spent 1500 on a bootleg Gorilla ju.
    A. The seller says it might be fake (meaning it’s fake)
    B. It’s missing the omake.
    C. The netting cap is the wrong color
    D. The paint is just a little off in color and application and you can find this paint sample on Zhengs insta.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Hirota Saigansho HS gorilla sofubi/294964383316
     
  22. SpectralNight

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    HA!
    I literally found this thread because I was wondering if anyone else was talking about it :shock:. While I don't know HxS well enough to notice the details on the netting cap, the underside of the feet looked off to me. Plus, there was a lot more silver on the hands and face than the photos I've seen of the real ones. Eyes looked sloppy too. The photos weren't great (which I'm sure was also intentional) obscuring potential softer details from the remolding. Otherwise, it was a sharper fake than some of the other HxS examples in this thread.

    While I was almost certain it was fake, I also just like those gorillas and was debating... if the price stayed low enough... maybe a fake was worth a couple hundred to me? LOL. It was a fleeting thought! And I would never have followed through for that color. But, I certainly know it wasn't worth $1500. Ay caramba!!!!
     
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  23. Bob

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    I couldn’t believe someone went this high as a punt. There were so many red flags with this listing I was expecting it to maybe go low hundreds but as they say a fool and their money are soon parted.
     
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  24. Anti Social Andy

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    Caveat Emptor!
     
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  25. Mr Fox

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    So bloody true.

    I recently bought a lemon, from some fellow on the internet, and it was neither sour nor juicy.
     

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