Violence Toy

Discussion in 'Americans and Other Western Gaijin' started by kid_miracleman, Oct 12, 2015.

  1. IronPaw

    IronPaw Line of Credit

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    A couple of collectors have bought these figues ONLY because some of the toy gods painted them. They have stated that otherwise they would probably never own one.
    That feels very "hype by association".

    I keep checking them out since the VHS gimmick is pretty cool. But the whole line of toys remind me of shitty bootlegs made for shits and giggles. Plus the price point, Real Head charges around 7000 for a full size toy. Of course they aren't one offs but I would shudder seeing Violence Toy try to paint a run with any sense of uniformity based on what they have put out so far.
     
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  2. toothaction

    toothaction Team Tsubu Staff Member

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    It is, actually. Skipping straight to 1-offs, pricing them 2-3 times higher than any other freshman on the scene, and having a lottery sign-up option on the front page of your site before you've even released a toy are all moves that don't suggest humility or necessarily give the impression of people who are doing it just because they enjoy the hobby. I never called them dickheads, plenty of perfectly nice people have produced mediocre things, but their model out of the gate was pretty much the polar opposite of every North American maker that I respect. The wares available at Middle of Beyond have the advantage of being well-designed and seemingly of decent quality, but the subject matters chosen are literally nothing but trend-hopping and 'scene-hyping' - other people's ideas and properties rendered in non-traditional formats - so the involvement there only emboldens the argument that many here have made by offering an established precedent - these toys appear to be a pastiche of a number of ideas generated or made popular by other people. Not a crime itself (in the case of the toys - I do hope that a number of the textiles from MoB are licensed), but certainly an invitation for critique.

    Did the bulk of the commentary from page 2 of this thread sadden you as well?
    None of my stated issues were new to the conversation, and folk like Maddie and Mitch expressed them with much greater eloquence than I did, but smurph and Odi's chat made me think that a little reminder of what all bothered us at the start of this thread would be timely and appropriate.

    TL;DR: I never said they were bad people. I see no reason to walk back on the h-b-a cop.


    EDIT: The initial quotation ended up as an unintentional word-salad. Corrected now.
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2016
  3. MisterYuck

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    I did see the custom snail men they released alongside Rotten Studios, and the paint jobs were pretty cool. Price point considering the figure's size I think is just a tad high, but they are one-offs. I've personally never really been a fan of shops who just rely solely on customs, instead of releasing purely unique "own-brand" items.
     
  4. Anti Social Andy

    Anti Social Andy Die-Cast

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    Don't believe the hype!
     
  5. Lixx

    Lixx Mr. Grumpy™

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    Christ on a bicycle with a sidecar! I was wondering why I was being quoted. It's the internet and every a-hole has an opinion, stop being so thin skinned. Not to pull the been here so long card but its true: If you're around here long enough you see people come an go with various motivations as to why they came in the first place. It comes out eventually regardless. People get a little bitter seeing folks just come here to try to capitalize on trends so folks are wary that's all. Not saying your pals are evil scum sucking vermin incapable of basking in sofubi world. But being entrenched in sofubi world for quite some time you see all the trends and to me these feel like bad quality knock offs of so many toys I never even liked to begin with. Is it a surprise? Or do they think they should be applauded for just making a toy? Congratulations they've joined a ton of other toy makers from around the world. I just see no originality or effort- who cares if you can paint the designs suck. Why is it no one can take harsh criticism anymore? We have to be political correct and sugar coat everything? If my professor says my data sucks, I'm not crying in a corner somewhere- I improve it.

    Does my opinion matter? Nope not one bit. These will never appeal to me because I'm a purist, like my licensed characters, and 95% of the time if it wasn't made in Japan I'm not going to pay attention. Doesn't mean every toy not along these lines is shit just as you say different strokes. I do think these are crappy toys though.
     
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  6. kichigai

    kichigai Removed by request

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    Chris that sums up how I feel pretty much to the nail.

    Why do so many people get their pulse up when someone expresses the exact reason they don't like something?

    Some VTs look fun but the concepts seem to be overshadowed by marketing.

    It appears as if they and others new to the scene saw NNN, SHB, HXS and most American producers and said "that is for me!"

    Personally I think lotteries by design are complete rubbish, many times they increase folks exploiting
    the "chance" at something knowing damn well they will offer it for more money to the folks that lost.

    Then manufacturers start complaining about folks entering their lottery and exploiting their fanbase.

    Why can't people just make standard runs of what ever they do?

    I never saw any of the BS that goes on behind the scene until lotteries became the fashion.

    It seems lazy to be honest and only done to create hype.

    Don't folks even have faith that the toy that they make can speak for itself?

    So few people seem to make things because they want them themselves, more by the day I see patterns
    of repetition and heard mentality. Do you need directions to the local slaughterhouse?

    Props to VT for at least making an effort even if they are not for everyone.

    Speak your mind but some of you need to quit attacking others who disagree.

    Better yet, make something yourself if you hate everything around you.
     
  7. smurph

    smurph Comment King

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    Will be the first to admit my collecting habits/tastes run heavily on the 'American Idol' or "gaijin-fubi" (if you want to be shitty about it) side of the spectrum... it is what it is.

    Only preface with that to state the GLARING difference between these 'Idols' and 'Violence Toy' that I see. The western artists who built a name & following for themselves in this hobby did so through YEARS of paying their dues. Usually starting with painting/custom work, then resin figures, THEN maybe their first vinyl toy after gauging that enough interest is there to make that leap a wise decision.

    Not to mention that most (if not all) of these artists' creations are a clear homage to the vintage/classic kaiju that spawned this resurgence.

    Can any of the above be said for 'Violence Toy'? If not, then the "hypez by association" indictment hits the nail right on the head.
     
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  8. Odibex

    Odibex Comment King

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    The lottery thing is pretty weird and/or annoying to me, but I think you can want to release an exclusive colorway and still have confidence in a particular sculpt. I don't really enjoy it, and I think the practice is way to commonplace, but I can see some appeal to the tactic. Particularly in hobby that's already quite niche.


    It did take me a while to wrap my head around the concept of paying for something you'd won in a lottery, though :|
     
  9. xSuicide Squadx

    xSuicide Squadx Super Deformed

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    I honestly think I'm the only person that's had a change of opinion with these toys that didn't initially like 'em. Admittedly, I'm still not too keen on the pricing, but as they keep selling it's obvious the amount is working for them, and fans don't mind too much.

    Yes, at first, I did not find anything really redeeming or enticing about these toys, or the paint apps. However, as mentioned in a previous post, I wasn't opposed to the idea that my opinion could be swayed, as I hadn't seen 'em in hand yet. DCon definitely opened me up more to them and they've slowly won me over, albeit in very specific and preferred arrangements, i.e. head, arms and body styles. The more I look at these sculpts, the more I feel I find intentionally expressed aesthetics, rather than forced slaps of texture. I also think the paint apps have been progressively becoming more flattering and complimenting to the sculpts.

    All that being said, I find no fault or argument towards any of the criticisms expressed here. I don't even feel like I have to go into detail with that, just that most of the "negative" opinions are coming from extremely seasoned, not elitist, collectors that have see enough to be weary. In my opinion, the best thing Violence Toys can do is stick with it. Keep doin' what they're doin' and take it for the long haul with creativity, rather than proving skeptics right by attempting a fast cash grab and dippin' out when it doesn't work(which I don't at all think is the case here).

    I also don't at all fault some collectors being a fan of any toy only after a particular artist has added their magic touch. It's much like comic books, in my opinion: an inker can make or break an illustrator's work in some(not all) cases. The most recent example I can give is the Mimi Monster, which is a great toy, and has had some excellent paints(VT's versions included) and some not so excellent.
     
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  10. Anti Social Andy

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    xSuicide Squadx post aside, the last few posts have hit the nail on the head in regard my view if the current 'scene'.

    Each to their own, but the shenanigans and dicking around have all but killed my interest. This shit is expensive enough these days. To have to jump through hoops or 'win' the opportunity to overpay just feels like someone's taking the piss.

    Modern sofubi isn't like some kinda buried gold or antique artefacts that have been lost or destroyed through time to the point of extinction . . . some guy thinks 'I'll make a run of X and charge a shit ton more for 'em than making a run of 10 x X just because its easier, and when X + 1 guys want to buy 'em it looks like I'm God's gift to sofubi'.

    I've been here since Methuselah and these days pretty much only collect from guys I know/respect and their help in avoiding all the shenanigans is the only thing that keeps my collection growing . . . and my sanity!
     
  11. Odibex

    Odibex Comment King

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    Well, not yet, anyway ;)
    I know who Methuselah is (well actually I don't, but I know it's a common old guy reference), but for some reason I still thought you were referring to a sofubi maker. I even did a Google search :lol:
     
  12. 3wing

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    Methuselah was a super old bible dude. He was like 700 and related to Moses.
    Guess the used to live that long; back before GMOs and Jobs and stuff.
     
  13. Odibex

    Odibex Comment King

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    :lol:
    This is so wrong, it's right.


    Oh, and I can be a prick to fledgling toy makers, too:

    [​IMG]
     
  14. MisterYuck

    MisterYuck Comment King

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    they look like lego guys during a bad acid trip. you were correct in putting that trash can there.
     
  15. 3wing

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    You think someone could just get Zbrush savvy?.... damn.
     
  16. IronPaw

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    I would agree if the said collectors actually wanted to continue collecting or changed their mind about VT.
    But it was bought purely because it was a big name artist that painted, it doesn't sound that they will
    ever buy another VT again.

    Hype by association.
     
  17. xSuicide Squadx

    xSuicide Squadx Super Deformed

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    I mean, that's a pretty thin line. They could've bought an artist specific paint because of the hype behind the name, or because that's their favorite artist and they simply enjoy their sprays, colors, details, placement, etc.
     
  18. Odibex

    Odibex Comment King

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    Rather than risk you having missed my joke, I posted the trash can to point out the design's uncanny (and presumably unintended) resemblance to one, not to suggest they belonged in the trash. Although, I guess there was a dual message being communicated there. These are by far the lamest most unimaginative "platform toy" designs I've ever seen, and I already find platform toy designs to be pretty lame and unimaginative. The guy reacted with a big laughing smiley (or "sticker" as Facebook calls them :roll:), so he didn't take it too badly. Which is good, because I really don't enjoy hurting people's feelings, or crushing their dreams. Not yet anyway. A little more time around here and that may change ;)
     
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  19. MisterYuck

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    Oh man I didn't get a trash can design vibe from those figure...it was all lego in my brain. Totally dual message there.
     
  20. Odibex

    Odibex Comment King

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    Dude. You totally missed the joke! I immediately saw TRASH CAN when I saw these. It's certainly possible he's from a Country that has totally advanced beyond that particular trash can design (like how Japanese toilets are part robot now), though, I don't know.
     
  21. Count

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    Have you heard of Bemon?

    I didn't realize North America created the sofubi scene and that all within it had to follow their code of ethics and business model or be damned?

    Have you heard of Bemon, Secret Base all of the 2 headed Famous monsters guys that were made before the officially licensed one, or really any toy that has ever been sculpted or painted in homage to something else that was already made popular by someone else?

    VHS packaging and cover art were my favourite part of going to the video store before I could even rent horror movies, I think it's a fun idea for toy packaging and isn't necessarily cashing into as wide of a cool guy audience as you're imagining, I think nerds always live in a bubble that way and don't realize that it will still only really appeal to toy nerds that like VHS tapes, which is a niche of a niche group. Most straight up VHS collectors probably wont even give a fuck.

    And how you can hate on a Heroin collaboration?! In the past Heroin has collaborated with toy artists, put a series of madball boards out years ago and just generally have done whatever FOS is into, with the team, with their videos, with their shapes with their graphics, and again it all only appeals to a niche of a niche and will only get more popular as more people get turned onto it. If these guys jumped in to do a collab with Nike or something I could get the backlash to cashing in on the hype, but I'm sure these guys are just stoked to be collaborating with a company that they have probably respected for a long time and that is also into what they're doing. Heroin is also probably the only skate company that puts out videos on VHS though, so they're obviously just hypey and not in it for skating in the first place.

    To be critical the legs to torso proportions kind of bother me on that one sculpt, but I also haven't seen it in person. And if you're mad at the price they're charging it could only be because you want to buy one but you think they cost too much money, otherwise you're just being salty.
     
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  22. MisterYuck

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    ^^^ FOS and Deer Man are both legitimately nice and super chill people.
     
  23. toothaction

    toothaction Team Tsubu Staff Member

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    @Count - Okay. I didn't realize that I thought all of those things. Heck, I didn't even know that I said some of those things, Thank you for educating me both on the world and on the true intentions and scope of my chosen words.
     
  24. Count

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    @toothaction hey no problem, I just think the backlash to certain things can get carried away sometimes.
     
  25. boon velvet

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    :lol: Ooh man, who does this sound like?
     

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